Fort Scott 40 gr. Solid Copper TUI

[lklawson]

Considering trying the Fort Scott all copper, 40 gr., TUI bullets. I'd like to stick with the published powders (5, 7, True Blue). The published data lists Hornady V-MAX, Siera Hornet and SPT at 35 gr. to 45 gr.

I've done bullet substitution before but never with a cartridge as fiddly as the 5.7. Any recommendations/suggestions on which bullet/powder combo to start with when substituting the Fort Scott all copper 40 gr.?

Thanks!

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

[Toprudder]

You probably already know this, but I think it is worth mentioning. Copper bullets will be longer due to the lower density of copper vs lead. Seated to a similar OAL, the copper bullet will leave less internal space than a lead bullet. Start with a lower charge than the minimum published data for lead bullets.

So far I have only used True Blue, but my results were very good. That is the powder I would start with.

[lklawson]

Thanks.

You're right about the density. I was hoping someone had a recommendation on which bullet to substitute for but I guess I'm going to have to try to get the precise length for all the bullets from the manufacturers.

That's a pain in the neck but better than a kaboom.

Peace favor your sword (mobile)

[Grantness]

I would start w/ the published loads for 40gr bullets and work up in .1gr increments, checking for pressure signs. I think Ramshot lists TB starting load for 40gr Sierra Hornet at 5.6gr. They have an OAL of 1.45” which seems short. You could potentially increase the OAL if the bullet is longer.

I’ve not loaded any solid copper bullets w/o bands. I’d be interested to see how they compare.

[lklawson]

Length of bullets for starting place for substitution

Sierra 40 gr Hornet has a nominal (drawing) length of 0.487”
Sierra 45 gr Hornet - 0.535”
Sierra 45 gr SPT - 0.625”

Hornady 40 gr. V-Max - 0.684"
Hornady 35 gr. V-Max - 0.517"

Fort Scott 40 gr monolithic copper TUI - 0.6980" OAL

Maker Bullets 32 gr monolithic copper expanding - 0.58" (caliper measurement by user)

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

[lklawson]

Ladder Loads; AA7 6.2, 6.4, and 6.6 grains. 1.58 COAL. Hopefully it will dry up and I can go test them today.

Those bullets are so pointy you could pull a splinter with them.



Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

[panzermk2]

You draw blood comment got my going LOL

YES we will be selling the 40grain version of the Dev bullet also just like we do with the 40gr Trident bullet.
I will supply load data.

Well they had inspiration............ Like VG they copied my design. This is the older Dev bullet.


All of mine where needle sharp and do draw blood if you aren't careful.

35gr before we called it the Dev round


First bare copper 40gr


Then anodized black



I change the design though for two reasions.
1) Weight, I wanted to get it in the 27gr range.

2) The long tip was to easily blunted and stopped by steel and other hard targerts.
That's why with the most recent version of the Dev you see a chisel point.

[panzermk2]

More pics

[lklawson]

Cool. Thanks for posting the pics.

I was able to get to the range. No pressure signs on these loads. I think that 6.8 gr. of AA No 7 is probably the max for this bullet but I didn't exceed 6.6 gr.

Accuracy was fine and did not seem to be greatly affected by each load. They were all about on par with each other despite the increasing velocity. Average velocity for the first rung was 1705. Average velocity for the second run was 1770. Average velocity for the third rung was 1851 with a extreme top of 1994. A rough average of 70 fps gain for each 0.2 gr. increase.

I tested against a brand new 3A soft panel. They penetrate easily.

Peace favor your sword (mobile)

[Shotty]

Cool. Thanks for posting the pics.

I was able to get to the range. No pressure signs on these loads. I think that 6.8 gr. of AA No 7 is probably the max for this bullet but I didn't exceed 6.6 gr.

Accuracy was fine and did not seem to be greatly affected by each load. They were all about on par with each other despite the increasing velocity. Average velocity for the first rung was 1705. Average velocity for the second run was 1770. Average velocity for the third rung was 1851 with a extreme top of 1994. A rough average of 70 fps gain for each 0.2 gr. increase.

I tested against a brand new 3A soft panel. They penetrate easily.

Peace favor your sword (mobile)

Excellent work! Pistol platform I presume?

[Grantness]

Cool. How did the primers look at 6.8gr?

[lklawson]

Cool. How did the primers look at 6.8gr?

Like the factory loads I shot.

If I can manage, I'll take some pics later.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

[lklawson]

Excellent work! Pistol platform I presume?

Yes. PSA Rock

Peace favor your sword (mobile)

[Buffman]

I loaded some to 6.9 and they looked fine but may go to 6.8 to account for an temp above 80F

[lklawson]

I loaded some to 6.9 and they looked fine but may go to 6.8 to account for an temp above 80F

For my purposes, I don't need it.

Brand new 3A test panels from BulletproofEveryone

6.4 gr. load:
Entry:


Exit (about 4.5-5" of uncalibrated modeling clay in a cookie tin):


6.6 gr. load:
Entry:


Exit:


So, for my purposes, 6.6 is just fine. I don't think I need to got 6.8 or more.

And just to verify that the panel was "working" I shot it with two 9mm about 1" apart.
Entry, no exit, and about 2" of backface deformation in the (uncalibrated) modeling clay:




Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

[panzermk2]

So, for my purposes, 6.6 is just fine. I don't think I need to got 6.8 or more.

And just to verify that the panel was "working" I shot it with two 9mm about 1" apart.
Entry, no exit, and about 2" of backface deformation in the (uncalibrated) modeling clay:

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

OH no worries we believe you, 40 solids in 5.7x28 have been ripping through armor for 20 plus years now.

Folks new to the 5.7 though all sound just the keyboard commandos on the this forum back then.

[panzermk2]

That a pipe tobacco tin that got re-modeled?

[lklawson]

OH no worries we believe you, 40 solids in 5.7x28 have been ripping through armor for 20 plus years now.

Folks new to the 5.7 though all sound just the keyboard commandos on the this forum back then.

I'm sorry that there's no "like" button.

That a pipe tobacco tin that got re-modeled?

I love the daisy-burst on it. The best part is that it was a christmas cookie tin. I did manage to cut my thumb on it though. I didn't even feel it. Just noticed blood.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

[lklawson]

Cool. How did the primers look at 6.8gr?

Like the factory loads I shot.

If I can manage, I'll take some pics later.

Primers on the left were my handloads. Primers on the right were factory loads. I can't really see much of a difference.



Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

[panzermk2]

primer type since I seem to have missed it?

[lklawson]

primer type since I seem to have missed it?

CCI Small Rifle.

No idea about the factory loads on the right.

I know that 5.7 is really hard on primers and, because it looked so much like the factory results, I wasn't worried.

Peace favor your sword (mobile)

[panzermk2]

ALL Elite Ammunition, SS190 SS192 SS193 SS195 and SS198 Small rifle.

American eagle, SS197, and all the the new stuff small pistol.

[lklawson]

ALL Elite Ammunition, SS190 SS192 SS193 SS195 and SS198 Small rifle.

American eagle, SS197, and all the the new stuff small pistol.

Yes. I would expect no less from the elite ammunition stuff. The published loads I'll call for small rifle but I don't know what small rifle the factory stuff is using. I know that I used CCI but I don't know about anything else. All I know is that it's fn.

Peace favor your sword (mobile)

[Stl57shooter]

YES we will be selling the 40grain version of the Dev bullet also just like we do with the 40gr Trident bullet.
I will supply load data.

Jay,

What's the ETA on a batch of Dev 3.0's, and will it be accompanied with the 40gr projectiles just like the last T6b release was? I can't wait.

[panzermk2]

Most likely bullets first, just to much demand for T6B and not enough brass cases.

[panzermk2]

And just like the 40 trident I will supply 5.7 and 223 load data.

[Stl57shooter]

Any update on when the 40gr Dev projectiles will be released?

[panzermk2]

Soon, I just put a video up here,


https://rumble.com/v3l34jj-elite-am ...

[Stl57shooter]

Sweet!!!! And your gonna release loaded Dev 2.0s too, and Zombinators. It'll be Christmas in October, wohooooo!!!!!